Tough times ahead for Intel: industry insiders spill the beans on subpar 10 nm yields, server CPU plus 7 nm delays, production outsourcing and more

[Redaktion]

Industry insiders reveal that Intel's current 10 nm yields are nowhere near viable for "full production" and even with the SuperFin tech, 10 nm production may never match that of the 14 nm nodes. Plus we get more details about the performance issues with the upcoming server-grade CPUs, even more delays for the 7 nm nodes and new details about the product outsourcing plans.


https://www.notebookcheck.net/Tough-times-ahead-for-Intel-industry-insiders-spill-the-beans-on-subpar-10-nm-yields-server-CPU-plus-7-nm-delays-production-outsourcing-and-more.509532.0.html

[Areader]

Sic transit gloria mundi..... 8)

[JayN]

"7 nm is significantly more delayed than the 6-12 months first claimed. Ponte Vecchio is in-hands basically now and it was the first 7 nm product. "

you mean Intel's first 7nm product is in hand?  That seems to be good news.

They also built eyeq5 chips on TSM 7nm in 2018, btw.

[JayN]

"Upcoming SuperFin 10 nm nodes are "unquestionably far better than base 10nm. Better in just about every way. Yields are better (50+%),"

10SF yields are 50% better than 10nm?  Seems like great news.  I see plenty of TGL laptops for sale.  Intel announced designs for 2020 had increased from 50 to 100, so the demand could explain the shortage.

Also, Dr Su said in a recent interview that they couldn't service the peak in educational demand, while Intel stated they were no longer capacity limited.  I guess the educational customers don't mind being on 14nm and AMD can't get more capacity at TSM.

[JayN]

"Even with SuperFin tech, the 10 nm production capacity may never match that of the 14 nm nodes."

You mean match the yields or capacity?  Both are on DUV equipment. 10nm requires more DUV equipment for the multi-patterning.  Never is a long time...  Intel increased capacity by 25% in 2019 and again by 25% in 2020 according to recent interviews with Swan.

[béla]

And what about next year's Enhanced SuperFin 10nm? and Alder-lake mobile CPUs?

Have you heard anything about it? I'm so-so curios what they will offer. I think everything will dependd on how good will be the hardware scheduler. That's why I'm struggling between Tiger-Lake H and Alder-Lake...

we shall see later

[JayN]

"Milan is going to likely beat Sapphire Rapids over a year earlier ..."

Milan doesn't have DDR5 support, PCIE5, CXL, Optane, AVX512, AMX tiled matrix operations, bfloat15, dlboost, right?

So, why compare it to Sapphire Rapids, which does have all those features?

[Henry Douglas]

If I had Intel stock, I would be selling right now. After they moved base to Israel, it seems that they've only gone downhill.

[edde dee]

Is any credit from this reddit poster?

[John Mardinly]

I worked at Intel for 17 years in Q&R. Intel persistently shortchanged Q&R. Not enough LYA (Low Yield Analysis) staff, not enough LYA equipment. So now they are dying because of low yield? They made their bed, now they are lying in it. Andy Grove is probably spinning in his grave at how stupidity has overwhelmed his company.

[pdx]

"Milan is going to likely beat Sapphire Rapids over a year earlier ..."

Milan doesn't have DDR5 support, PCIE5, CXL, Optane, AVX512, AMX tiled matrix operations, bfloat15, dlboost, right?

So, why compare it to Sapphire Rapids, which does have all those features?

wow it's like you actually think rattling off a bunch of buzzwords means something.  do you even realize adding ddr5/pcie5 is literally just standards adherence, and everything else you listed are stupid single-customer gimmicks that no general software actually uses?

[Ranajay Deb]

IS TSMC PLAYING WITH INTEL'S SITUATION.....
AMD'S SUDDEN DOMINANCE IS SOMEWHAT DOUBTFUL....

[Some random guy]

This article talks about 10 nm and mentions cannon lake? Wtf like y'all are so stuck on cannon lake and that debacle that you can't even analyze what is actually happening. I bet most of the people here don't even realize that the whole 14, 10, 7 nm debate is actually pointless, how can you actually talk about node process size when you don't even know what is happening? Just to make clear none of these processors are actually 14, 10 or 7 nm node if you look it's not anywhere near that also nobody considers gate, drain sizes and so on how can you talk about "node process" lithography when you don't even know what it's about? Don't even get me started on core quality when all these people out here are touting that more cores = better cpu, if that was the case AMD or ARM would have taken over a long time ago. Intel might be having a tough patch but y'all are out to lunch if you think a giant like that is just going to keel over and die.

[Leo Kuan]

"Milan is going to likely beat Sapphire Rapids over a year earlier ..."

Milan doesn't have DDR5 support, PCIE5, CXL, Optane, AVX512, AMX tiled matrix operations, bfloat15, dlboost, right?

So, why compare it to Sapphire Rapids, which does have all those features?

Obviously some of these "features" are not desirable for some users or even "hated" such as avx512;  and AMD CPUs are not just "subset" of INTC CPUS -- they have their own features based on their customer needs.

[ariliquin]

A new CEO and some acquisitions of usable technology that assists in resolving yield issues wouldn't go amiss, along with a renewed investment in their key asset, people.