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EPOS GTW 270 Hybrid hands-on: More than just an excellent solution for gaming on the go

Started by Redaktion, September 28, 2021, 22:10:11

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Redaktion

Although EPOS advertises the GTW 270 Hybrid as a solution for low-latency mobile gaming, there's more to it than just that. Also compatible with the Nintendo Switch and the PlayStation 4 and 5, the EPOS GTW 270 Hybrid shines on PCs as well, but is it good enough to justify the US$199 price tag?

https://www.notebookcheck.net/EPOS-GTW-270-Hybrid-hands-on-More-than-just-an-excellent-solution-for-gaming-on-the-go.562115.0.html

anon

I am very glad to see a review of these earbuds in particular, because they are one of the few audio products to come with a dongle specifically to enable low latency connections.

I have posted here before about aptX-Low Latency and its shortcomings. In brief, using aptX-LL capable earbuds like the Sennheiser Momentum True Wireless works, but basically only with a separate Bluetooth aptx-LL capable USB dongle. These are less common, but thankfully a USB type-A or type-C dongle can work with either PC or phone, and usually also with consoles.

AptX-LL is pretty low latency but I ALWAYS hear pops and clicks with it. I have tried many combinations of devices, dongles, and other Bluetooth adapters, and if low latency works then it is responsive but has terrible quality. My headphones, HyperX Cloud Flight, came with a proprietary dongle and are both low latency with flawless sound quality.

So, for this review I am glad you mention the audio quality (no crackling), I also know that when starting audio from silence the first bit might be cut off, especially on old Bluetooth devices but even with an aptX-LL dongle, and wonder if that happens here.

I also would have really liked to have seen latency timing, even if roughly estimated, with separate measurements from PC and phone connections. In my case I don't have test equipment so I will simply watch a video like Audio Sync Test, and block off the left and right sides of the number line with pieces of paper until I narrow in on precisely how much latency it is, to within about 20 ms.

The best I get on PC is near 0ms or 20ms with the HyperX Cloud Flight, or with Momentum TW Sennys and a Creative BT-W3 dongle using aptX-LL.

Razer's annoying-to-use "Gaming Mode" devices that don't support aptX-LL (?!) are at best 60ms. This is low enough to not notice it but every single time I turn on the device I need to power it, wait for it to pair, and can only then hold down the "gaming mode" button for five seconds to turn that on. Ridiculous.

It is important to note that phones compensate for latency somehow. This makes PC usage a much worse experience comparatively, unless the device is truly low latency. It can be different app-to-app. I suggest using a rhythm game app because it is a realistic latency-sensitive usage and those apps have good settings for latency adjustments.

And with aptX Adaptive coming out, with the newest Qualcomm mobile chips supporting it, can newer Bluetooth earbuds actually achieve ~80ms latency in rhythm games on phones without a dongle? I thought information on aptX-LL was hard to come by. but this new spec is even less clear to me.

Codrut Nistor

Quote from: anon on September 29, 2021, 01:41:09
I am very glad to see a review of these earbuds in particular, because they are one of the few audio products to come with a dongle specifically to enable low latency connections.

I have posted here before about aptX-Low Latency and its shortcomings. In brief, using aptX-LL capable earbuds like the Sennheiser Momentum True Wireless works, but basically only with a separate Bluetooth aptx-LL capable USB dongle. These are less common, but thankfully a USB type-A or type-C dongle can work with either PC or phone, and usually also with consoles.

AptX-LL is pretty low latency but I ALWAYS hear pops and clicks with it. I have tried many combinations of devices, dongles, and other Bluetooth adapters, and if low latency works then it is responsive but has terrible quality. My headphones, HyperX Cloud Flight, came with a proprietary dongle and are both low latency with flawless sound quality.

So, for this review I am glad you mention the audio quality (no crackling), I also know that when starting audio from silence the first bit might be cut off, especially on old Bluetooth devices but even with an aptX-LL dongle, and wonder if that happens here.

I also would have really liked to have seen latency timing, even if roughly estimated, with separate measurements from PC and phone connections. In my case I don't have test equipment so I will simply watch a video like Audio Sync Test, and block off the left and right sides of the number line with pieces of paper until I narrow in on precisely how much latency it is, to within about 20 ms.

The best I get on PC is near 0ms or 20ms with the HyperX Cloud Flight, or with Momentum TW Sennys and a Creative BT-W3 dongle using aptX-LL.

Razer's annoying-to-use "Gaming Mode" devices that don't support aptX-LL (?!) are at best 60ms. This is low enough to not notice it but every single time I turn on the device I need to power it, wait for it to pair, and can only then hold down the "gaming mode" button for five seconds to turn that on. Ridiculous.

It is important to note that phones compensate for latency somehow. This makes PC usage a much worse experience comparatively, unless the device is truly low latency. It can be different app-to-app. I suggest using a rhythm game app because it is a realistic latency-sensitive usage and those apps have good settings for latency adjustments.

And with aptX Adaptive coming out, with the newest Qualcomm mobile chips supporting it, can newer Bluetooth earbuds actually achieve ~80ms latency in rhythm games on phones without a dongle? I thought information on aptX-LL was hard to come by. but this new spec is even less clear to me.
First of all, thank you for commenting and spending that much time to get in depth, I appreciate it a lot! Now, let's get down to business...
1. Thank you for the info on the HyperX Cloud Flight, I came across HyperX headsets on multiple occassions but never took the time to pay more attention to them or get some for me to review. As far as I remember, I contacted Kingston asking about the possibility of review samples but never got a reply. Maybe I should ask them again some day, or just go and buy some.
2. Regarding the "starting from silence" part, there's a certain latency here as well. I guess there's a period after which the buds go in power saving mode, so it's normal to have a delay when they power back up. Half a second, maybe, maybe even shorter, but it's noticeable. Not annoying at all, if you ask me, but it would be nice to be able to set that in the software or maybe have custom firmwares with different power-saving settings.
3. Measuring latency timing would have been nice, indeed. Sadly, no equipment for that on my end, either. Definitely something to add on my shopping list...
4. I've seen a bunch of TWS with Game Mode setting lately, I got a bunch around here with at least 4-5 to review in the coming weeks/months. Nothing impressive, to be honest. In most cases, the Creative Outlier Air v2 turned out to be snappier than earbuds with "Game Mode" advertised and highlighted as a big feature - no such thing on the Air v2, of course.
5. Oh, yeah, apt-X adaptive... more marketing mumbo-jumbo, to be honest. I'd rather go with v1, v2, v3, and so on, with clear differences between them, maybe maximum two revisions for each major version.
Oh, yeah, on PC latency could be caused by messed up drivers and/or hardware problems. Feel free to check that out with LatencyMon - https://resplendence.com/latencymon
Finally, thank you for suggesting rhytm games. Have any particular one(s) in mind? My daughter was into a few such games recently, I think I might have tried one or two in the past, but can't name any other except Guitar Hero. :D

anon

The game "Beats" (com.beatsportable.beats) by Keripo on Android is the best I know of for testing. From tapping the app icon, to playing a song, you can get going in 2 seconds. Other apps can load for minutes. Beats has the setting "Music Offset" with +/- 0.0125 second granularity. With Advanced Setting "Timing Debugging" you can see how close your timing was for each tap, in milliseconds. And it supports 120fps play, and is open source. But development has stopped and it is not a mass-market game.

My most played mobile rhythm game would be... well, I think what I like to play is less important. Anyway it's one of those games with two download progress bars and three loading screens before you can play. Okay, it's a Superstar game.

I have found that looking out for aptX-LL compatibility has been useful (aptX has a web page showing every consumer device which supports it) just because my Momentum True Wireless buds do sound really nice (frequency response-wise) and now I know that if I ever want a low latency connection with them I will need a dongle. No phones support aptX-LL natively at all.

About PC latency, I understand hardware interrupts could cause momentary drops in real time audio (frames, or is the term packets?) but in general I find the latency when on a PC to be the most consistent and probably most representative of the hardware transmit/receive latency. On mobile it varies--with aptX or SBC one might actually find that video and audio are better synced on a phone than on PC, but it seems that is only because the video is delayed in compensation by the app or OS or something. Try comparing the default movie player to VLC for android.

As for headsets, the HyperX Cloud Flight at least sounds, after the initial startup connection beep, just as I would expect plugged-in headphones to sound. No crackling (unless far away), no cut off audio. They are flawless in that regard but not necessarily the best frequency response. There are other headsets from Arctis and Logitech that are probably similar but reviewers think sound better. But they are full headphones and might even use a large dock and not just a USB dongle.

Bottom line, I think we have not yet seen wireless earbuds with or without a dongle, that have no audio defects and have low latency. Stretch goal: a working microphone at the same time.

I don't think even Airpods Pro connected to an iPhone meet these specs (144ms from a reviewer stephen coyle).

Codrut Nistor

Thank you once again for your in-depth comments! Looking forward for your feedback in the future. Got a bunch of audio hardware under review currently and a few others that should arrive in the coming weeks if everything goes well.

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