interesting my battery pack lasted 59 mo and 40, 850 miles  before becoming " unbalanced "(hmmm.. like elon?) going into limp mode , and then DOA mode.. over 350 miles fom home WITH ZERO WARNING... NONE
when your vehicle loses regen, the schedule service line appears.. your are doomed.
the model s brakes i found are barely adequate w/o regen.. SCARY in a hilly area like Virginia Shenandoah Valley..
make sure you have AAA 200 mile PREMIER TOWING.. YOU WILL NEED IT. The car HAD2B DOLLYED  AS IT WAS COMPLETELY DEAD..EVEN THE 12V AUX ..
3 WEEKS WAITING SO FAR..
REMEMBER THAT BATTERY CHANGE IN THE TIME OF A PETROL FILLUP ?
COMPLETE & UTTER FRAUD .. NEVER HAPPENED..NEVER WILL.. MORE TESLA BS . that  vehicle WAS STAGED.. HALF APART ALREADY.. THEY DIDN'T INTRODUCE THE BATTERY PACK TO THE REST OF THE CAR EITHER.. OR DEBUG IT..  COMPLETE TESLA ELON MUSTY  BS.
I WILL NOT BE A 3RD TIME TESLA BUYER.
2 WAS ENOUGH .

I have a 2017 Model X. It's covered 520,000km in its life as a Chauffeured Car.
The Battery was replaced at 380,000km after its failure. Cost me NOTHING on its 8yr unlimited kms warranty. 
The X is a heavy car, sharing the suspension from a GLE MERCEDES. So the extra 400kgs does take a toll on suspension components. 
I used to operate high-mileage TAXIS, now just Hire Cars. The dinosaurs here claiming that ICE cars are no more in cost to run just haven't operated commercial vehicles driven by different drivers. 
My cost benefits are increased markedly because of the Kms its covered. With the free charging, no servicing and only 2 trips on the back of a tow truck. . (And I've lived the pain of owning an Audi Q7, Mercedes Viano & Valente). 
Who knows, I may have gotten a car built in heaven by angels. NOTHING comes close to it for reliability

Quote from: Dennis1025 on June 16, 2024, 12:49:11Always excuses as to why these EV turds have bad specs. The weather wasn't favorable which caused the already low mileage to drop even further. What garbage.

The range is based on the EPA test. Poor conditions can lead to lower range/mpg on both ICE and EVs, it is the laws of physics. What they are saying is the actual range loss is likely less

QuoteAssuming an ice engine vehicle with 430k miles on its engine would break down nearly twice to go that distance is foolish. A vehicle with 400k miles on its engine has been taken care of and likely won't break down. That's been my experience with high mileage combustion engine vehicles.

But that is the difference, an EV can 400k+ miles without "taking care of it".

QuoteThe claim of no maintenance has to be on the battery only. No way has it gone 430k miles without numerous tire replacements, I doubt the motors have gone 430k miles since that hasn't been mentioned, and the drive unit has likely been swapped out a time or two in that span as well.

They actually do mention that tires were swapped, the motor unit was not swapped. Motors are way more reliable than engines in general

Quote from: A. Junco on June 16, 2024, 16:17:54I have a 2020 model 3, with 41k miles.  The car is constantly 40-60 miles off its self reported range.  Example: if I charge it to 240 miles (92% charge), I will only get 200 miles of range (on average).  Why? When advertised new range was 324.  I have never gotten that "advertised" range (granted I bought it used).  Tesla has recently down graded it's range estimates for its cars (I keep reading), but on its web sales page it still says the model 3 long range should get 324, LIES!  I have had the battery checked and been told repeatedly there is nothing wrong with it, the computer or the charging / battery system.

I've had no problem getting the advertised range. The range is based on the same standardized test that ICE cars take. The only reasons why you would get lower range is: Weather, Terrain or driving style. Since you did not have an issue with ICE cars(assuming you paid attention) and assuming you don't have a lemon, then the likely cause is your driving style. The amount of loss you are having is around the amount regenerative braking gives, are you regening? Are you also gunning the pedal?

My sprinter is the star. Running at 452k gives me 540miles full tank. Valued next to nothing. But still keeps my family fed.doing 60k to 70k per year

Quote from: A on June 16, 2024, 08:47:09Stock tyres on a Model S usually last 30-40k miles and if you do a tyre rotation, rebalance, wheel alignment service maybe 10-20k more. We're more likely to see 10-15 tyre changes services in 430k miles.

Yes there is less brake wear in EVs but no brake service in 8 years means 8 year old fluid, no level top ups, no caliper lube, no new pads or no new discs.

How safe is an 8 year old Model S, or any car with 430k miles on it that has never had a service of any kind?

What do you actually mean by no service?

I believe the article read no service of any kind to the battery not no service of any kind to other components of the vehicle. I know people don't want to hear this but I'm 40k into my w year old EV (EV6 gtline) coming from a decade+ of lexus vehicles. EVs are better at getting people from point A to point B. I live in cold climate, don't have a garage, use strictly level one charging and it's been a hassle free transition/ownership. I will be purchasing another EV when I purchase my next vehicle. Oh and BTW EVs are beasts in the snow with the added weight and center mass so close to the road, with the right tire of course.

My 2007 tahoe has 575,000 miles on it
I have put brakes on it a few times..lol but it runs the same hot or cold rain or shine. Last feb in the white mountains of nh -47 deg with wind chill it started right up...didn't like it but it did. I'm not opposed to ele tric I just know what I have works good. I don't know any vehicle electric or gas/diesel that doest need maintenance

No maintenance on original batteries in 8 years is believable. I7hf you believe $0 spent on electric motor/motors, driving the wheels in 8 years, too much koolaid.

Not sure what the author is trying to relay. But if a tesla loss 40 mile in 430k freaking awesome! Any gas power car at 430k is really going to junk yard.

The article has a opposite or negative effect on tesla and ev's. Driving it to the last mile (to have to push it,  and blame it on the weathe. He must have stock in tesla, and trying to get more people on Musk ev bandwagon. Musk could have done something great if he had concentrated on affordable ev's before wasting billions on Twitter and cybertruck. Now to demand 56 billion in stock, (even if his handpicked board previously approved) as an incentive to keep working at Tesla. Too many delays and  broken promises, or outright lies from Musk.

Update: The second paragraph of the article has been updated for clarity. EVs are undoubtedly more efficient than ICEs - even on highways. What I meant to say was, unlike ICEs, EVs are 'less' efficient on highways as compared to city roads due to already mentioned reasons (regen braking, lower speeds)

Quote from: FrankS on June 16, 2024, 08:38:58Technically speaking EVs are still more efficient than ICEVs on motorways, but ICEVs are less inefficient when running at a constant speed. Diesel contains about 10kwh per liter, so to be more efficient an ICEV would have to do more than 35 miles per litre (159 mpg!) on the motorway

But combustion engine itself is only about 15-25% efficient, not counting how much more energy spent in fuel transportation, refining, distribution and etc.

Whether it is an electric car or a gas-driven car, all cars are tested by automobile companies at sea level, which is an ideal condition to maximize their performance. However, in practical use, performance may vary as we may drive automobiles at different altitudes where there is a change in air density and oxygen availability. Internal combustion engine (ICE) cars can lose power and efficiency because the air is thinner and contains less oxygen at high altitudes. Similarly, an EV's range can be affected by air resistance, which is why the advertised mileage often differs from the mileage achieved during practical day-to-day driving conditions.

The statement is fairly inchoherent. The electric care is more efficient (by which we mean does more work per unit of energy input) then does the ice vehicle.

the model s has a lower cd then most ice vehicles it has a lower rolling resistance than most ice vehiciles and what's most important  it has more efficient power train than all ice vehicles.

Yes it's more efficient at highway speeds, yes it's more efficient at city speeds. It's driving around with the every density equivalent of less than 3 gallons of gas.

An interesting if not very well executed article.
I have a Hyundai IONIQ EV, 2p per mile, a Diesel Range Rover Vogue, 45p per mile, and a Petrol Mini Convertible 18p per mile, so I have a horse for each occasion.
My costs per mile are for fuel alone.

If my IONIQ EV performs as well as this Tesla does I will be chuffed.

Only the ignorant and mentally challenged would criticise Electric Vehicles in the way that some people do, these Electric Cars will not last long as the governments of the world will eventually dictate that all people will drive Hydrogen Cars, so that they can continue to squeeze every bit of tax out of drivers possible.

The largest Hydrogen processing plant in the world is under construction in Saudi Arabia, believe it or not, as he said, long ago.
This Is The Way.

I have a 2020 model 3, with 41k miles.  The car is constantly 40-60 miles off its self reported range.  Example: if I charge it to 240 miles (92% charge), I will only get 200 miles of range (on average).  Why? When advertised new range was 324.  I have never gotten that "advertised" range (granted I bought it used).  Tesla has recently down graded it's range estimates for its cars (I keep reading), but on its web sales page it still says the model 3 long range should get 324, LIES!  I have had the battery checked and been told repeatedly there is nothing wrong with it, the computer or the charging / battery system.

  Tesla lies greatly about the range it's cars get.  Unlike every ICE car I have ever owned the estimated mileage based on its built in range estimating computer is accurate or underestimates the distance to empty giving you more range.  One major reason people don't like EV is the range anxiety.  If the distance to discharge was accurate then it would be a better feeling while driving.  But to know that you will only get 200 miles out of your 240, or less, paid for electrical charge is crap.  On my 2015 Chrysler 300, I put 18 gallons of gas in and the computer says 360 mile range.  When I drive it, I get the 360 or more if I do highway miles.  If I do city miles it is correct or short by 5-10 miles, never have I had range anxiety with any of my ICE vehicles.