Quote from: heffeque on March 03, 2024, 11:31:54These are you guys: https://imgur.com/gallery/TOyutm1

It's embarrassing.

You mean those financed experts who start everything with "we think", "we believe", "studies show" and such? Experts like:

from Sept. 18, 1995 (nytimes.com)

"At the most likely rate of rise, some experts say, most of the beaches on the East Coast of the United States would be gone in 25 years. They are already disappearing at an average of 2 to 3 feet a year."

?

Did most of the EC beaches disappear by 2020?

-

Edit: Nope, just checked, they are still there where they were 25-30 years ago.

It's especially funny when someone refers to official "experts" but has never verified their claims to the most detailed level. But some people check...

Quote from: heffeque on March 03, 2024, 11:31:54It's embarrassing.

posting that meme is embarassing actually, because nowadays you can find contradicting studies on anything and then just cherry-pick to "prove" one point or another. yeah, temperature is rising, but yeah, it's just a normal ending of a little ice age and yeah, temp was even higher in medieval climate optimum, without any human or cow fart influence. so pick your poison and prove whatever you want.

These are you guys: https://imgur.com/gallery/TOyutm1

It's embarrassing.

Some people checked the facts and realized that there is no Covid-19 at all. This is about real critical thinking.

And North America has turned into Lilliput, where sharp-pointed and blunt-pointed people argue about how to properly cook "eggs", which, no matter how you look at them, are still the same mafia...

Sincerely, it's sad to see what used to be a powerful and educated nation being slowly transformed into a "red vs blue" where everything is 1 or 0, with zero critical thinking, and an ever accelerating society collapse.

Some people thought that Covid would transform societies, and better the human spirit, and... in some cases quite the opposite happened. People drinking bleach, injecting horse medicine... and still denying human-made climate change.

It's sad. Very sad.

Quote from: Hotz on February 27, 2024, 12:58:38Thanks@Anti-propagandaman for doing the fight against these dumb climate propagandists.

I honestly don't have the energy for that, because every day a new idiot wakes up and parrots every s*** they hear from the media and do not any research themselves of how everything is full of lies, deception and propaganda.

Yes, it's exhausting. There are maybe 50 arguments they have heard and repeat that have to be refuted. I believed climate change was real and probably caused by CO2 for about 20 years, until the past two or three years when I started listening to the real scientific substance of the debate. I'm angry at having been misled for that long and the tactics they use to push this nonsense and silence opposition. The amount of time, money and resources that are being wasted in this global crusade are astronomical.

Thanks@Anti-propagandaman for doing the fight against these dumb climate propagandists.

I honestly don't have the energy for that, because every day a new idiot wakes up and parrots every s*** they hear from the media and do not any research themselves of how everything is full of lies, deception and propaganda.

For causes of the Little Ice Age, here is some overview:
de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kleine_Eiszeit#Ursachen

Quote from: anan on February 21, 2024, 17:55:03You are literally cherry picking the data. Smack dab in the middle of the "little ice age".
You are right on one part - your CET example is "very" regional in nature. But it does track the global temperature trend that you can look up in this link: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age

Yes, I know it's at the end of the Little Ice Age... the point is no-one knows what caused that 2C temperature rise or the other 1C rise and falls throughout the 19th century.

Do you agree with the following statement, YES or NO: "The late-20th century temperature increase is therefore in-line with the natural rate of change. The IPCC and you say the current rate of change is unprecedented. It's not."

Quote from the bottom of the wiki article you posted:

QuoteSpontaneous fluctuations in global climate might explain the past variability. It is very difficult to know what the true level of variability from internal causes might be given the existence of other forces, as noted above, whose magnitude may not be known.

Quote from: Anti-propaganda man on February 14, 2024, 18:50:32Yes I looked at it. Did you? There's a 2C average rise (10-year average) from 1690-1735. There's many other 1C rise and falls through the 19th century at the same rate and magnitude as is happening now. The late-20th century temperature increase is therefore in-line with the natural rate of change. The IPCC and you say the current rate of change is unprecedented. It's not. Yes I am aware that a wikipedia editor and the IPCC said the recent rise has been attributed to human-caused climate change. So what? There is no good evidence that it has (in terms of CO2). The temperature rise is not unusual so it doesn't actually even require an explanation.

The most common response is that the Central England Temperature records are local and not global records. Of course, there are no global records going back that far. There are proxies, but they have other major issues. The CET records for the 20th century match closely global records for that time period, so that's an argument that the records back to 1659 would also match global temperature.

There's so much more to write, many thousands of words in fact. If you're interested in the real debate then I'd advise you as a starting point to look up the names I posted earlier and listen to interviews with them.

Thanks.

You are literally cherry picking the data. Smack dab in the middle of the "little ice age".
You are right on one part - your CET example is "very" regional in nature. But it does track the global temperature trend that you can look up in this link: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age

Yes I looked at it. Did you? There's a 2C average rise (10-year average) from 1690-1735. There's many other 1C rise and falls through the 19th century at the same rate and magnitude as is happening now. The late-20th century temperature increase is therefore in-line with the natural rate of change. The IPCC and you say the current rate of change is unprecedented. It's not. Yes I am aware that a wikipedia editor and the IPCC said the recent rise has been attributed to human-caused climate change. So what? There is no good evidence that it has (in terms of CO2). The temperature rise is not unusual so it doesn't actually even require an explanation.

The most common response is that the Central England Temperature records are local and not global records. Of course, there are no global records going back that far. There are proxies, but they have other major issues. The CET records for the 20th century match closely global records for that time period, so that's an argument that the records back to 1659 would also match global temperature.

There's so much more to write, many thousands of words in fact. If you're interested in the real debate then I'd advise you as a starting point to look up the names I posted earlier and listen to interviews with them.

Thanks.

QuoteWrong. The oldest thermometer record in the world going back to 1659 shows many changes at the same rate and magnitude as is happening now - Central_England_Temperature_(CET)_(annual_mean,_beginning_in_1659)

Did you actually look at the picture you have linked or are you just paroting this 'fact' from some other source without looking. It clearly shows a warming trend during the last 100 years of > 1 . And even the article where this picture is posted clearly states that this is a result of human caused global warming. Quote from your source:
Both the general warming trend and the hottest year on record at the time, 2014, have been attributed to human-caused climate change using observational and climate model-based techniques. This record was subsequently broken in 2022, when a mean CET of 11.15 C was recorded, 1.68 degrees above the 1961-90 average and breaking the 2014 record by nearly 0.2 Celsius.

Quote from: anan on February 13, 2024, 16:42:20Animals and plants are dying out

you need to stop reading crap you are reading, animals and plants were always dying out, at quite high rate

Quote from: anan on February 13, 2024, 16:42:20I live in central Europe and in my country winters have become milder.

your life is short, you are talking about weather, not climate. every region had mild or rough seasons at some point. very often in succession.

Quote from: anan on February 13, 2024, 16:42:20more parasites are surviving winters and decimating forests (specifically firs and pines)

means more predators feeding on these species survive too. and predators of that species. nature is self-balancing, doesn't need your opinion or input to even everything out.

Quote from: anan on February 13, 2024, 16:42:20a lot of central Asia traditional farming is made impossible due to increased droughts

there is always someone displaced because of droughts in the world, stop reading whatever biased crap you are reading

Quote from: anan on February 13, 2024, 16:42:20coping somehow by virtue of technological advancement

Quote from: anan on February 13, 2024, 16:42:20farming is super negatively impacted by climate change

would cope totally fine if not stupid govt legislations, both US and EU. eu farmers are protesting not because their farming is being destroyed by climate change lol, they are protesting because govt doesn't let
them have profit

brainwashed 'climate change' zealots are at large wth

The U.S. is the last best hope for a free world, once again, unfortunately the climate realism movement in other Western countries is pathetic or non-existent. There's a lot of large organisations in the U.S. working to influence government that there's no good evidence that CO2 is causing warming, and that more CO2 is actually good for the biosphere and thus civilisation in terms of extra crop growth. Recent CATO report that CO2 increases over the current century will lead to a 50% increase in productivity in some crops - https://www.cato.org/blog/projecting-impacts-rising-co2-future-crop-yields-germany

This kind of news which is drastically contradictory to the doom and gloom fake news tends not to be reported. Institutions that have been pushing climate alarmism for 30 years can't really turn around and say they've been wrong all this time. They have to continue.

2023 paper from 37 authors in 18 countries finds global temperature increase can be attributed to a combination of urbanisation around weather stations that weren't designed for long-term measurements, and a measure of solar activity that the IPCC ignores - https://www.ceres-science.com/post/new-study-suggests-global-warming-could-be-mostly-an-urban-problem

Quote from: anan on February 13, 2024, 16:42:20Earth is heating up at an unprecedented rate. Meaning this has never happened before at this rate of speed.

Wrong. The oldest thermometer record in the world going back to 1659 shows many changes at the same rate and magnitude as is happening now - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_England_temperature#/media/File:20190731_Central_England_Temperature_(CET)_(annual_mean,_beginning_in_1659).png