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Posted by davidm
 - Today at 15:04:20
Quote from: Phil.k on Yesterday at 23:06:37Says tested against highest end x86 chips. Ignores middle range threadripper with the same core count and better cinebench scores

That's like the "25% improvement" comment. Test it comprehensively on a range of benchmarks, including price:performance, wattage:performance, db:performance. And test it with up to 500GB of RAM. The M-chip is not going to win all of them, but some of them will be quite revealing.
Posted by Phil.k
 - Yesterday at 23:06:37
Says tested against highest end x86 chips. Ignores middle range threadripper with the same core count and better cinebench scores
Posted by Oum
 - Yesterday at 17:22:18
Twice the cores but 25% improvement only ? Sorry I think Apple lost here
Posted by davidm
 - Yesterday at 17:03:24
Quote from: Sasquach on Yesterday at 16:28:17
Quote from: umbrella on Yesterday at 08:50:30everyone keeps mentioning core count but that's somewhat irrelevant here, AMD still uses hyper threading meaning 32 threads. Intel ditched hyper threading and has 24 cores. Either way though there's no cheap way to obtain an m3 ultra, it's apple, so maybe it is fair to compare it to server parts.
At 14k price point I can have dell workstation sporting 2TB ram and thread ripper 7995wx with 96 cores.
That thing will run circles around M3 ultra. Especially with an option for 4 GPUs....

I don't know what kind of deals you get, but a Dell Precision 7875 with 7995wx & 2TB would be more than seven times the price of the top end Mac Ultra in my country, not including GPUs. And its RAM speed is still around half the M3 Ultra's.

Whether it runs circles depends on the task, for many tasks a $600 entry M4 would be faster. To run an LLM larger than 70b, you're going to need multiple professional GPU$$$ (about $60k worth), and you don't want that sitting on your desk. Though, M3 Ultra's startup time is pretty slow for larger LLMs, and is ultimately limited, but we're talking about something that sits on the corner of a desk in a quiet office.

As for software, a lot of Windows & Linux software looks like crap. When I have to use a Mac, I just turn all the colours and widgets off, and I'm left with a terminal (though I'd still 100% prefer to be using Linux). It's whether it runs the right software quickly.

As I said in the AMD thread, I'd like to see nbc run head to head tests of the m3 ultra against the top end x86 chips, not because I prefer Apple, but because moments of humiliation is the only way x86 is going to pull ahead.

Obviously, each system will have its own advantages, unless you're coming from a bizarre ungrounded "twice the cores but 25% improvement" perspective, Apple's lines of chip are an incredible advancement.
 

Posted by Sasquach
 - Yesterday at 16:28:17
Quote from: umbrella on Yesterday at 08:50:30everyone keeps mentioning core count but that's somewhat irrelevant here, AMD still uses hyper threading meaning 32 threads. Intel ditched hyper threading and has 24 cores. Either way though there's no cheap way to obtain an m3 ultra, it's apple, so maybe it is fair to compare it to server parts.
At 14k price point I can have dell workstation sporting 2TB ram and thread ripper 7995wx with 96 cores.
That thing will run circles around M3 ultra. Especially with an option for 4 GPUs....
Posted by Shaun
 - Yesterday at 12:07:30
The comments section is why most PC gamers are degens.

Happy to compare a £€2500 PC to a £€600 or less console...then they cry that people compare a super high end Mac that's probably £€10k+

(Gamed on both for most of my life)
Posted by Tecnical
 - Yesterday at 11:53:01
What is this !? Comparing a $15000 mac with a $2500 pc ! LoL!
This isn't a fair comparison. You should compare it with a Threadripper system.
Posted by Ayush
 - Yesterday at 10:27:27
Imagine comparing an ARM CPU with absolute garbage software support to full fledged x86 cpus and that too after paying 10x higher price
Posted by umbrella
 - Yesterday at 08:50:30
everyone keeps mentioning core count but that's somewhat irrelevant here, AMD still uses hyper threading meaning 32 threads. Intel ditched hyper threading and has 24 cores. Either way though there's no cheap way to obtain an m3 ultra, it's apple, so maybe it is fair to compare it to server parts.
Posted by Jason Rogers
 - Yesterday at 08:17:35
Quote from: MonkeySpanx on Yesterday at 08:08:44At that price you should be comparing it to threadripper systems, with way more cores.

That would be suicidal 🙂
Posted by MonkeySpanx
 - Yesterday at 08:08:44
At that price you should be comparing it to threadripper systems, with way more cores.
Posted by RobertJasiek
 - Yesterday at 08:01:41
Quote from: cyberwizrd on Yesterday at 01:09:53for local AI they are monsters

Not in general for local AI. The main criteria are: How much VRAM / assigned unified memory does the software need? Is the software written for Apple M or Nvidia dGPU? Depending on the software, it might or might not work on both systems, and speeds might differ by a factor of several dozens.
Posted by Anny on mus
 - Yesterday at 05:59:21
What about single core performance? And the major problem is having to use apple software which is absolute garbage.

Also some products look like s***. I want a machine not some baby toy.
Posted by BrendaEM
 - Yesterday at 02:20:11
For the same reason my the M3 Ultra comparison to an Dual Epyc would also not be fair.

Blender with Blender-data is now my de-facto benchmark.
Posted by Geek Therapy Radio
 - Yesterday at 02:04:28
Another, more honest way of looking at it: You have to pay thousands more for a 30% performance increase. Thousands. Not a few hundred. Multiple thousands of dollars.

I say that as someone with a 59050X/RTX 3090 and a Macbook Pro 16 (and Air, and iPad Pro).