Quote from: Yo on February 06, 2025, 01:32:27It's ecology activist groups turn to slow down the project ^^ (spoiler: it already started).Five years of delays due to activist groups... yep, very convenient.
Quote from: Yo on February 06, 2025, 01:32:27We are getting away from the subject."not wanting it/feeling the need" yup, there you go. Thanks for agreeing!
Midcat is a Gaz pipeline, France estimate the cost for the french part at around 2 to 3 billions EUR while not wanting it/feeling the need.
BarMar is Hydrogen, they studied feasibility during 2023/2024. Feel like putting the cart before the horse to me.
Quote from: Yo on February 06, 2025, 01:32:27I will not get into the "France is hiding part of the cost" I'm not good enough to check, EDF handling is so fucked up even from outside it shines.Agreed.
Quote from: heffeque on February 06, 2025, 00:12:17The original target of the Biskai link was for it to be completed and operational by 2023. For now the estimation is for 2028, but who knows if France will resist/slow down the project even further.It's ecology activist groups turn to slow down the project ^^ (spoiler: it already started).
Quote from: heffeque on February 06, 2025, 00:12:17There are multiple of other examples during the early 2000s, and a couple of other recent ones like the MidCat pipeline and BarMar.We are getting away from the subject.
Quote from: heffeque on February 06, 2025, 00:12:17And just to add something else: France is "hiding" part of the cost of nuclear energy by state subsidizing EDF with bailouts, loans and debt guarantees. Also by putting price caps (42€/MWh as per the ARENH mechanism) to sell nuclear-generated electricity below the cost of production for newer reactors. Aaaand adding to that by externalizing/excluding costs (maintenance, updating and decommissioning costs, plus the fact that nuclear waste management costs are not transparent at all).The 42€/MWh (ARENH) is imposed to EDF by EU to lower its competitiveness. They have to sell at a loss to COMPETITORS (they resell it at higher price), it made scandals during the gaz apocalypse with competitors firing customers while keeping electricity rights (@42€) and reselling to EDF more than five time the price once customers went to EDF for electricity (EDF can't refuse to provide electricity to a customer by law).
Quote from: Yo on February 05, 2025, 22:37:582024:Actually, you are right.
France imports from Spain = 6.6 TWh
Spain imports from France = 9.4 TWh
You are literally lying...
Quote from: Yo on February 05, 2025, 22:37:58And an other lie, the Iberian derogation started early 2022 for 12 month and got extended until end of 2023... A few days... What a joke...The law has been in place during that period, yes, but executing it only took place a few days during 2022 during extreme price spikes. The rest of the days the Iberian derogation was not executed because prices did not go high enough.
Quote from: Yo on February 05, 2025, 22:37:58It's a DEROGATION given by EU commission WTF, I feel like feeding a trollWhat's your point? Why didn't France request it too?
Quote from: Yo on February 05, 2025, 22:37:58False again...The original target of the Biskai link was for it to be completed and operational by 2023. For now the estimation is for 2028, but who knows if France will resist/slow down the project even further.
Go check project "Golfe de gascogne/Golfo de bizkaia" started in 2018 to be delivered in 2028
And "Baixas - Santa Llogaia" delivered in 2015
Quote from: heffeque on February 05, 2025, 11:48:42Added to that:2024:
France exports more electricity because it's connected to countries that are even more expensive than France.
Spain exports to France more than France exports to Spain, and it has been like that for over a decade, before the "Iberian derogation".
Quote from: heffeque on February 05, 2025, 11:48:42Added to that:And an other lie, the Iberian derogation started early 2022 for 12 month and got extended until end of 2023... A few days... What a joke...
The "Iberian derogation" only took effect a few days during the following days after the NS2 destruction, when Europe had to start importing gas from US fracking (which was too expensive to sell to Europe before NS2's destruction). The "Iberian derogation" hasn't been used again since then because it hasn't been needed.
Quote from: heffeque on February 05, 2025, 11:48:42Added to that:It's a DEROGATION given by EU commission WTF, I feel like feeding a troll
France could implement it too. If they aren't, it's their choice.
Quote from: heffeque on February 05, 2025, 11:48:42Added to that:False again...
France blocks the construction of larger power-lines between Spain and the rest of Europe, so Spain can't sell more of the electricity to Europe (which actually is a good thing for Spain, as electricity prices would increase if they started being able to sell more to Europe: so France's greediness is actually helping Spanish citizens, helping power-intensive industries, and improving Spain's economy, which is improving at a higher rate than countries with higher energy costs).
Quote from: toto1234 on February 04, 2025, 07:41:12Just build 20 new nuclear reactors, and stop this green renewable BS madness.
Quote from: Yo on February 05, 2025, 04:40:52EU electricity price must obey a stupid rule (for french consumers especially): the most expensive energy source needed to stabilize the grid set the price (at EU level), so french electricity price is set mostly by Gaz price (super clever system without Russian gaz). Spain and Portugal got a derogation to not obey that rule, search for "Iberian derogation", that's why u think what u think.
2024 net export of electricity:
France: 89 TWh
Spain: 2.8 Twh
EDF (French historical electricity company) is literally forced to sell 100TWh of electricity every year at a fixed price (42€/TWh) to competitors by EU because nuclear is too competitive (it's called ARENH)
Quote from: heffeque on February 04, 2025, 19:12:32Spain's electricity is much cheaper than France's, and it's thanks to renewable energy production (traditionally hydro, but continuous building of more wind and solar are making prices lower even further).
Nuclear reactors are just too expensive, they're slow to build, and complicated to maintain.
Quote from: toto1234 on February 04, 2025, 07:41:12Just build 20 new nuclear reactors, and stop this green renewable BS madness.Spain's electricity is much cheaper than France's, and it's thanks to renewable energy production (traditionally hydro, but continuous building of more wind and solar are making prices lower even further).
Deutsch
English
Español
Français
Italiano
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Русский
Türkçe
Svenska
Chinese
Magyar